Roundtable Part One - Jeff Oliver, Mike Boyle, Brijesh Patel, and Eric Cressey

Apr 28, 2010   John

I feel like healthy discussion and debating should be candid - so, in the interest of great material (in my opinion), I thought gathering some of the brightest minds I know and talking shop would be enlightening. I sent a series of questions to four friends/colleagues - with the stipulation that they answer the questions without consulting each other, with the hope of contrasting the styles of four guys who just flat out get it done, albeit each in their own way.

The first is Jeff Oliver, the Director of Strength and Conditioning at Holy Cross. He has been a tremendous mentor to me, and is a great friend. Jeff is hands down one of the smartest guys I know - but would never let you know it. Above all, he is a one of the best coaches I know. He has an impressive coaching tree�, and has been a great role model to many people in the field - the mark of a guy who has made a huge impact in the field of strength and conditioning.

The second is Mike Boyle - love him or hate him, the guy has been a tireless force in the advancement of the field of S+C. I've figured out that all the education and lecturing that he does is for that reason above all. I've seen it in how he structures things at Mike Boyle Strength and Conditioning in Boston - if you work there, learning and getting better is not an option - it is mandatory. Even if you don't agree with what he says or writes, it sparks healthy debate that eventually leads to overall improvement as a field. The guy knows what he is doing, and has been doing it well for a long time. And most important: he still trains athletes all the time! Visit his website at www.strengthcoach.com for great material.

The third is Brijesh Patel - Director of S+C at Quinnipiac College in Hamden Connecticut. The most organized, focused person I know - period. A great coach, and an even better person. Coach B's principles and thought processes have deeply impacted the way I view training, because they make a ton of sense and are deeply rooted in practice - tried and true, usually by B himself. A great mind who again is a tremendous contributor to the field. Visit his sites at www.sbcoachescollege.com and www.myfittube.com.

The fourth is Eric Cressey - founder of Cressey Performance. Eric is one of the brightest young minds in the field of strength and conditioning - again, a guy whose principles were developed in the laboratory - training himself, and training many others. Again, Eric is among the best at disseminating high quality, practical educational material to the masses, raising the overall quality of the entire field. Eric writes a great blog at www.ericcressey.com.

All great minds; all guys who practice their craft daily; all guys with faces perfect for print (much like yours truly).... The take home point: these guys all get results, and all in their own unique way. Read this piece with that in mind: improving your own philosophies and practices - not necessarily emulating any one!! Grab a beer (yes beer - not a protein shake) and enjoy.....

1. If you had to choose ONE exercise to do, what would it be and why?

MB:

Sled pushes. I wrote a small article on t-nation answering just that question. http://www.tmuscle.com/free_online_article/sports_body_training_performance/just_one_exercise

BP:

I would do Split Squat Holds/Isometrics. They help develop active flexibility, single leg strength, strength in the weakest position, teach proper body positioning for acceleration/deceleration, and help to develop mental toughness with longer holds.

JO:

One legged dead lift. Because I invented it : ) and because it involves the perfect athletic position with massive unilateral contractions of the calf, quad and glute. This is not a great exercise when done from the floor. It should be performed from the hang, with a bar to force the trunk into the proper angle of flexion to co-contract the quad and glute. The bulk of the weight should be place on the ball of the foot and the athlete should be careful to try and make the trunk parallel to the shin. It is the only unilateral, ground based, athletic specific exercise that, when performed correctly noticeably fires the glutes.

EC:

Definitely a tough call, but I'd go with some dumbbell lunge variation � whether it's forward, reverse, or walking. It challenges the grip, muscles of the upper back, rotator cuff, core, and lower-body. And, in terms of bang-for-your-buck from a functional carryover standpoint, it's hard to top something that puts an athlete in single-leg stance. Plus, most athletes hate single-leg work � and that's usually a sign that they really need it!

 

2. Is there one correct way to train athletes? I love the answers to this question - it makes an incredibly important point.... Keep in mind these guys didn't discuss their answers to this question - funny.

MB:

Yes, the way we do it at Mike Boyle Strength and Conditioning. All sarcasm aside, I think there is one best way. My mission for 30 years has been to try to find it. New info always makes us question our current methods. I think the fun is in trying to find the best way.

JO:

Yes, my way and I'm actually not kidding. I don't think using someone else's system that doesn't involve their passion is effective. The only good system is one that is coached passionately. It is very difficult to be passionate about another's creation. That being said there are actually hundreds and hundreds of effective methods of training athletes because there are hundreds upon hundreds of passionate bright coaches out there. The feedback from the athletes I train is that it's not quite the same if I'm not coaching it. It doesn't mean I'm a special coach, it just means that it is my program so I am the one that has the passion to see it succeed. It is where a lot of us fail when we try to hire others to project our passion. It just doesn't work particularly well. There is not one way to raise children, there is not one way to a successful marriage, only different levels and types of passion. Life without passion would be a "long hard slog".

EC:

Absolutely not � especially since all athletes have different functional demands, individual needs, injury histories, and proficiencies/deficiencies. I don't know of any one system� that accommodates this level of individualization � and that's probably why nobody has really franchised high-level performance effectively. The other day, one of my interns actually asked me how I would summarize our business model, and I just responded Be smart enough to adapt to everyone.�

That said, if you are a coach and you don't believe 100% that your way� is the best, then you need to reevaluate what you're doing.

BP:

The only correct way to train them is to train them best for what they need. This can be done using a variety of techniques, including isometrics, eccentrics, plyometrics, speed training, olympic lifting, high intensity techniques, and corrective exercise. The routine must be set up for the needs of the athlete.

 

3. When you are training an athlete, what are your four to five primary goals in order of importance (e.g. work capacity, max strength, etc.)?

EC:

At risk of giving the boring answer, it'd definitely depend on the athlete. Most basketball players you'll meet are incredibly weak, but have excellent reactive ability � so enhancing maximal strength is a priority. Conversely, try to make an already-strong powerlifter into a better athlete, and you've got to spend a ton of time on reactive ability. Loads of stretching might be detrimental to a gymnast, but helpful for a weekend warrior golfer who sits at a desk too much. So, it's different goals for different folks.

That isn't to say, however, that different goals aren't closely related. Often, improving maximal strength can stiffen a joint and assist make an adjacent joint more mobile � an example might be improving scapular stability and watching glenohumeral or thoracic spine range-of-motion improve. Conversely, mobilizing the glenohumeral joint or t-spine can make it easier for someone to strengthen the scapular stabilizers.

Since my answer was so clearly an it depends,� I'll give your readers a little tangent and say that I think work capacity� is wildly misunderstood by many S&C coaches. Work capacity is a highly task-specific thing, yet most of the time, training for work capacity merely entails interval training or some sort of circuit in the weight room.

By powerlifting standards, I have awesome work capacity; I can take loads of lifts at a high percentage of my 1RM. I got to that point by � you guessed it � taking more and more lifts at a high percentage of my 1RM (and doing the right amount of assistance lifts to supplement those efforts). My work capacity for, say, soccer absolutely stinks; it is a different set of demands.

This is a huge problem in the way that many pitchers are trained. It might come as a surprise that we do virtually no interval training with our pitchers (unless they have serious weight problems). They all focus on being functionally fit to pitch � which is a single explosive movement. Work capacity� comes when they extend their pitch count at the appropriate time of year � and the requisite work capacity for a reliever is different from that of a starter.

So, I guess when it really comes down to it, I'm not convinced that the weight room is the best place in which to build work capacity. There are definitely times and places for cross-training, but I think that the best work capacity improvements come with specificity: playing one's sport. I know a lot of folks use work capacity training to harden soft athletes, but it's been my experience that you can get the same benefit through other avenues without compromising the ideal training effect for that athlete.

JO:

Obviously the first response would be "it depends", but in order to not be viewed as a cop-out, here goes.

1. Mobility
2. Strength
3. Work Capacity
4. Power
5. Speed

MB:

First, strength- the one simple thing you can do for any athlete is to get them stronger.

Second, conditioning- they don't call the field strength and conditioning for nothing. The second best thing you can do for an athlete is get them in better shape.

Third, speed- faster is always better. Getting stronger is a precursor to getting faster. This is why I put speed third.

Fourth, power- stronger is great for injury prevention/ reduction but, power helps performance more. The problem is there can't be much power improvement without strength.

Many will question my order but, you said primary goals in order of importance. If I have to put them in order, this would be the order.

BP:

1. 1. Work Capacity - an athlete that does not have the capacity to train at a high level will not be able to perform the necessary amount of work to get better. Sufficient work capacity also allows the athlete to consistently work at a high intensity.
2. Understanding Body Position - an athlete that does not know how to activate certain muscle groups and put their body in correct positions in training will injure themselves and will not be able to perform the necessary movements to improvement.
3. Maximal Strength - strength is the underlying quality for all other strength qualities.
4. Power - athletes need to exert force at high speeds.

 

4. In your opinion, what is the biggest problem in strength and conditioning today?

BP:

Young people coming into the field have more knowledge than ever at their fingertips, but don't understand how much effort it takes to be a really good coach. They all think that they're experts because of how many books they have read but don't understand that it takes a lot of effort and time getting your hands dirty� to be good. There is no instant gratification to becoming a good coach.

EC:

I would say that one big issue is that folks go too far to one extreme or another. We have old school football coaches who just bench, squat, and clean kids. Then, we have some of the functional training� zealots who won't let clients do anything without an unstable surface. Finally, we have some (but certainly not all) Crossfitters throwing unprepared souls into extreme challenges.

Heck, in the past two weeks alone, I've heard that the Seattle Mariners dropped free weights almost completely in a new strength and conditioning initiative. Meanwhile, the Florida Marlins have integrated Crossfit. I wish people would just come to realize that the answer is borrowing bits and pieces from different philosophies to create something that's unique to each athlete, based on his/her needs.

Also, there are too many people talking a big game on the internet when they don't actually train anyone.

JO:

I think there are a number or problems in the field some of them are conversely positive. I think the internet has flooded the field with knowledge which obviously is a good thing. It has also flooded the market with instant genius. Now that I have done this for going on twenty years, I realize you can't replace hands on experience. It seems as though the more I do this, the more I realize that what you read in research and literature contains some fundamental flaws. As an example, we all grew up with a bias against the High Intensity System. In retrospect I think that bias is somewhat unfounded. I think that system can be very useful. It is better to have athletes working their tail off in a less than scientific� program then having them troll zombie-like through a well thought out program.

I think sometimes our programs are so complex with so many different facets that we have lost sight of what is really effective. I think some very well meaning coaches have taken us too far on the continuum between strength development and physical therapy. I think PT is great for athletes who need PT. I think getting athletes stronger is what strength coaches should focus more of their time on.

MB:

Crappy technique is the number one problem. It is amazing to see people on the internet who are supposed to be experts who's athletes are terrible lifters.

 

5. What are your favorite hobbies that have nothing to do with S+C?

MB:

I love to build things. I really enjoy renovating old houses. I also love to work on my computer. They are the only two things that make time fly like working in the gym.

JO:

Hmmmm... define hobbies.� Building stone walls. Politics. And wood reclamation. For those of you who don't have the pleasure (seriously) of knowing Jeff - he grew up in the country - he builds a mean stone wall, and splits wood for exercise (great choice).

EC:

Watching/following baseball � Granted, this is closely related to my job in the sense that 85% of my clients are baseball players, but truthfully, this has always been the case. My parents joke that I taught myself to read with baseball cards, as I knew all the players names and faces � and it was just a matter of matching them up to the words (names) on the cards I had. I love getting to as many games as I can and reading about the game (was even a fantasy baseball superstar for a few years). Following UCONN basketball would be a close second on the sports side of things; I still bleed Husky blue.

Getting up to Maine � My fianc�e and I are both from Maine originally, so we love to get back up there to visit our families as often as we can, especially during the summer. I love to fish and just get out in the boat, whenever I can get the opportunity.

BP:

Hanging out with my wife watching The Office, Lost, 24, and Grey's Anatomy as well as movies. Reading would be my other.

 

6. What is the single most common dietary/nutritional mistake you see athletes make? If you have your athletes follow the five common principles below they are eating better than most athletes.

JO:

Not enough protein and too many processed carbohydrates. I suppose that is two mistakes.

BP:

Not eating enough protein and not eating breakfast.

MB:

Hands down, not eating breakfast. Not eating fruits and vegetables is a close second.

EC:

If I only get one, I'll go with a catch-all: they don't follow the Green Eye diet. If it wasn't green and never had eyes, you probably shouldn't be eating it.

A derivative of this recommendation is to tell athletes that they can get just about everything they need on the periphery of the grocery store. Stick to this approach, and you get plenty of high quality protein, healthy fats, and the right kind of carbs (fruits and vegetables).

 

7. In your opinion, who is the best athlete in the world, and why?

MB:

I don't know who it is but probably the National league pitcher with the highest batting average. I don't enjoy baseball but I respect the skill set. Guys fail in MLB and go one to be successful college quarterbacks. That tells you something about baseball players.

(Editors note: If you polled 100 people I'm pretty sure nobody else would have that answer, and I think you could make a great argument for this one. Consider that most major league pitchers need to establish a sizable body of work at three levels of minor league baseball before reaching the majors - I think baseball is the toughest sport in which to reach the highest level of competition. Tom Glavine won over three hundred games and was drafted in the second round of the NHL Draft - 47th overall I think. Deion Sanders was one of the best athletes in the NFL and was a mediocre baseball player. Danny Ainge couldn't cut it in baseball. Ditto for Drew Henson, Dan Elway, and numerous others. Bo Jackson was an All-Pro as both an NFL running back and an outfielder for the Kansas City Royals - he is in my opinion the best athlete ever.)

EC:

If I had to take a stab at it, I'd say that the best athletes are probably the guys who have catapulted the UFC to such popularity. These guys have to be explosive in every plane of motion both in both bilateral and unilateral stance and on the ground � but still highly conditioned metabolically. Most of them are trained in multiple MMA disciplines. And, fighting is a completely open-loop drill, meaning that they have to react to whatever their opponent throws at them.

Plus, there is just something badass about the fact that every time they compete, there is a chance that they'll actually die. You've got to respect that.

BP:

I would say Lebron James is the best athlete in the world right now. He has an unbelievable blend of speed, strength, power, and work ethic which has quickly made him one of the best athletes in all of professional sports. (For the record - the guy is somewhere around 6'8� and 275 pounds and runs like a deer).

JO:

I don't think I could ever that question. There are so many incredible athletes out there. As an underdog, I like the guys who have worked their way into the top levels through investing in training and taking care of themselves